MyPUAJourney Forum

shirley, it feels unnatural, cause society programs us that it is. it also programs us that it is the women who choose, that we should supplicate to women. but we know that aint true.

Think of escalation like this: If you father didnt do escalate with your mum, would you be born. OF course he did, and many times. so did all the men in your ancestory.

TidalWaveRider wrote:Lol, this is bad ass. You can talk to Jack freaking Coxwell! And who's Mr. Rogers, Scott? This is nuts.

Jack, you seemed to build comfort with those 2 girls who at first didn't want your number but then changed their minds after the initial rejection. Were you using a particular set of principles to build that comfort? Props on the approach. Those girls were cute as fuck, even the one you weren't all that into (why weren't you all that into her, BTW, she was really pretty... was she wearing Man Repellent?). It all seemed so effortless, making those girls put down their guard. Give me some comfort tips, man.

Mr. Rogers (Scott?), you make a great point about making friends with everyone. I love making new friends, guys or girls. But the fact is guys are easier to be friends with. We know what to talk about at the comfort stage, like sports or hot women. What's confusing is when girls get to that point. In my head I'm going, what the fuck is interesting to this chick. Lip liner? The new fall fashions? I don't know shit about that. In my past relationships I didn't even know there WAS a comfort stage so I was just doing whatever the fuck I pleased, with disasterous results (sparse, long term, occasionally long distance, relationships). What the hell should I read that will significantly upgrade my comfort game?

Scott? Where the hell did you get Scott from lol? I'm not Scott.

Anyway talk to the girl like you would one of the guys, she can almost always relate the conversation to something in her life.

Example: Today at school, I was talking to this girl and the subject of hobbies came up. I told her that I like to race go-karts and drift cars in my spare time. Clearly she had little to no interest in that, however she mentioned that her 2 younger nephews were really into cars. So instead of talking about myself, I steered the conversation and let her talk about her family and how close she is to all of them and yadda yadda yadda.

You kind of have to feel it out and shift the conversation into something that interests her. I'm not sure exactly what it is but I think it's something like you do 10-20% of the talking while she does 80-90%

Just shutoff your brain dude, stop overthinking these things

Completely disagree Mr. Rogers. If you're not controlling the conversation (letting her do the majority of the talking) then you lose the ability to steer the interaction the way you want it to go.

You lose the ability to communicate to her your value. You become a "nice guy, who listens." but not the guy who she can't explain why she feels so attracted to.

1000% you need to listen to her responses, and be able to interact with her, but you need to be the one assuming the social responsibility of carrying the conversation and looking to her for input.

I'm not saying that you need to cut her off when she's telling you about her nephews, but you do need to steer the conversation away from them, and back to you. In your example, you could steer the convo back to you by interjecting something like "Wow, your nephews sound pretty cool! I've always liked cars because they << get my dick hard>> <<amaze me with their technical wizardry>> <<look really shiny and cool>> <<whatever>>." and stack forward to your next topic or idea that you want to talk about. Maybe a bit more about cars, or convey the story that you wanted to share about cars (I presume you didn't just open her with "I like cars" and had someplace you were going with it?) Never let a woman derail a story or thought you were trying to share with her. As soon as you stop conveying to her your positive values, then you're risking ending up "just" a friend.

And if you need to shift the conversation to something that interests her, then 1 of two things is happening 1) You're doing a poor job of conveying the excitement at the core of whatever it is you're talking about to her in a format that she can relate to or 2) She's honestly not interested in something that you value greatly, in which case, unless you're just trying to have sex with her, you're better off ejecting and finding a hot girl who IS interested in things that you're passionate about. Otherwise, you're just catering to her desires and setting up a lopsided relationship from the start, where she (and her ideas/dreams etc) is more important than you are.

Screw that.

Wow, I can literally feel my brain expanding with each new post Silver makes! The idea about telling her WHY comics matter is blowing my mind. More proof boys don't speak the same language girls do. I would never have to explain comics to a guy. With a boyish attitude like, "either you get it (unlike most) or you don't" I guess I've been a great communicator in the past!

Can you tell me if this could work on a girl, and how to improve:

"I love comics because the storylines are so compelling. Characters grow up having severe needs and flaws, make friends, sacrificies, tough choices, and change-- all for the greater good. The universes they inhabit are frighteningly and intensely different than our own. The X-Men, for instance, live in a galaxy where mutants with powers like magnetism or lightning exist, where time travel is possible, and space colonization is happening. And yet, even such strikingly differently worlds share sharp similarities with ours. Man's hatred and human capacity for atrocious evil is personified, as normal human beings fear and murder "mutees" and "mutee lovers". The main leader of the X-Men, Professor X, is a leader who believes in peaceful resistance and hopes for the day when both humans and mutants can co-exist in love and harmony-- much like the heroes from our history-- like Martin Luther King Jr and Muhammad Ghandi. When I read a comic book, I feel like I'm in the character's shoes, taking the wild rollercoaster ride that is the plot on a journey of limitless possibilities. It really pumps me up. And the art work makes the story epic, the different styles are like different spices... etc"
--only problem is this is a lot to memorize and I don't want to do that. How does someone get good at coming up with stuff like this on the spot?

Funny how innocently kino begins, yikes. I remember going to parties and seeing girls wrap their arms around guys they just met... yet it took them months for them to feel ok to do that to me. I often tore myself up over that, wondering what the fuck was wrong with me. That same feeling comes over me when I try to escalate-- feeling less than, unworthy or even repulsive. It's insane, pulling away from the touch you actually long for. But that's what I usually do. Changing that is gonna take some practice, I bet.

Silver, again, much respect and thanks.

canibus1990 wrote:shirley, it feels unnatural, cause society programs us that it is. it also programs us that it is the women who choose, that we should supplicate to women. but we know that aint true.

Think of escalation like this: If you father didnt do escalate with your mum, would you be born. OF course he did, and many times. so did all the men in your ancestory.

My mother was a rape victim you dick!!!

My conception aside, that may be it, it does feel innapropriate somewhat, like you're doin sumat you shouldn't be, crossin a boundary. I like the idea that society is the problem. Takes the focus away from me own fucked-upness Anyway, the source aside, I do actually know it's perfectly natural, I just need to implement that belief into me subconscious and consequently my natural behaviour. Anchors aweigh!

Shirley Knobsgood wrote:

canibus1990 wrote:shirley, it feels unnatural, cause society programs us that it is. it also programs us that it is the women who choose, that we should supplicate to women. but we know that aint true.

Think of escalation like this: If you father didnt do escalate with your mum, would you be born. OF course he did, and many times. so did all the men in your ancestory.

My mother was a rape victim you dick!!!

My conception aside, that may be it, it does feel innapropriate somewhat, like you're doin sumat you shouldn't be, crossin a boundary. I like the idea that society is the problem. Takes the focus away from me own fucked-upness Anyway, the source aside, I do actually know it's perfectly natural, I just need to implement that belief into me subconscious and consequently my natural behaviour. Anchors aweigh!

Lmao. No offense, but nobody on this planet would assume your mom was a rape victim so I think it's beyond silly to call him a dick! That said, I understand how unnatural escalation can feel. I'm in the same boat so I'm trying to come up with a beginner kino escalation activity: when I see girls on the street I'll ask them to high-five me, or some other small kino crap. Meh. Seems impractical. Never mind.

qixsilver: I never said let her control the conversation. If in fact you just yammer on about shit that she's not interested in she's gonna get bored and take control and then you get stuck in the friend zone, or she makes up an excuse and walks away. It's kind of like the saying "less is more"

Example:

TidalWaveRider wrote:"I love comics because the storylines are so compelling. Characters grow up having severe needs and flaws, make friends, sacrificies, tough choices, and change-- all for the greater good. The universes they inhabit are frighteningly and intensely different than our own. The X-Men, for instance, live in a galaxy where mutants with powers like magnetism or lightning exist, where time travel is possible, and space colonization is happening. And yet, even such strikingly differently worlds share sharp similarities with ours. Man's hatred and human capacity for atrocious evil is personified, as normal human beings fear and murder "mutees" and "mutee lovers". The main leader of the X-Men, Professor X, is a leader who believes in peaceful resistance and hopes for the day when both humans and mutants can co-exist in love and harmony-- much like the heroes from our history-- like Martin Luther King Jr and Muhammad Ghandi. When I read a comic book, I feel like I'm in the character's shoes, taking the wild rollercoaster ride that is the plot on a journey of limitless possibilities. It really pumps me up. And the art work makes the story epic, the different styles are like different spices... etc"
--only problem is this is a lot to memorize and I don't want to do that. How does someone get good at coming up with stuff like this on the spot?

I read that and I don't really give a fuck about any of that.

I would personally start off like he did

"I love comics because the storylines are so compelling. Characters grow up having severe needs and flaws, make friends, sacrificies, tough choices, and change-- all for the greater good."

and then somehow relate it to something she'd be interested in, such as a chick TV show IE The Hills, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives etc.

You could describe any of those shows almost the same way as the comics. But instead of her not giving 2 shits about the rivalry between Professor X. and Magneto, shes thinking more along the lines of Lauren vs. Spencer/Heidi.

This way you build rapport and your passive value skyrockets in her mind.

I might be wrong totally wrong on this one, but its just the way I've been doing it so far and it's been working out fairly well. If anyone has any opinions please LMK.

I already told shirley what i think privately.

I dont believe you should blame society, just realise that this stuff happens. One should always take responsibility not place blame on others. you got to be the change you want to see. no one else will change for you. you got to do it.

Why touching especially social touching is weird??? cause in western societies and i mean, english speaking ones, this not seen as normal. If you go italy or france, touching is more sociall acceptable, and just means social. whereas in english speaking countries, when a girl touches us, we think we are in and she wants us ( i mean have sex with us). i dont really know why this is. some body could enlighten me. Also coming from a certain religious background can have an impact on this. I know that muslims and catholics have strong view on sex before marriage, and this does impact people and the views and actions towards sex.

Mr Rogers. Maybe I misunderstood you, but when you commented that she should be responsible for 80-90% to your 10-20% I interpret that as her dominting/controlling the conversation.

Regarding grounding your world via theirs, I think is a risky game. The girl you meet may hate the hills, when you try to relate the two, suddenly, you're debating why the hills sucks - or doesnt suck - vs. conveying your idea.

I do agree on your coments re. tidal's specific example, and I'll use it to explain how I would handle it, which leads me to...

Tidal:
GREAT explanation of why you're into comics, BUT far to specific. With most women, as soon as you start talking about mutants or specific characters and their powers, they're going to tune it out. Remember with specifics, what's elementary to you, is NOT to them. for someone who doesnt read comics, Professor X is just a weird name, and Magneto, well, I wont go there. Using your words, here's what I'd keep (ok, I may reword a little)

I love comics because the storylines are so compelling. Characters grow up having severe needs and flaws, make friends, sacrificies, tough choices, and change-- all for the greater good. The universes they inhabit are frighteningly and intensely different than our own (but they share commonalities with us). When I read a comic book, I feel like I'm in the character's shoes, taking the wild rollercoaster ride that is the plot on a journey of limitless possibilities. It really pumps me up. And the art work makes the story (really come to life).

I wouldn't deliver this story as an opener, or as attraction material, but when in comfort, you've already generated attraction and most women at this point are open to listen to you and want to know what "makes you tick". If you have attraction, then by telling a girl why your hobby is more of a passion and what makes it such an integral part of your world will be interesting to her. I'd probably preface a hobby that has a dorky stereotype with a laughing comment about how you know the stigma. Maybe a prefacing segway like:

*note, this should be delivered as an obvious joke - overly straightfaced I'm thinking?!*
"Yeah, I'm a dork, I'm into pocket protectors, bug collecting and comic books. Oh! and I like to yodel on the weekends!" Let her laugh (hopefully she is laughing at your jokes - even the bad ones?) and after she's had her giggle, move to "no, seriously though, I am into comic books..." and launch into why.

By prefacing something that you know has a bad stereotype with worse things, and laughing at it, you let her know that you don't take it too seriously - which alleviates some of the dork vibe from it. Following that with a well thought out, normal minded rationalle that she may not have considered - that this cool guy who she just met is clearly passionate about - then she can accept it and appreciate it on the same deeper level that you do.

That said, learn the story, and then forget it. Don't memorize it word for word. If you do, then you'll just be an actor delivering his lines to her. If you feel like you have to memorize something, then memorize talking points like:

storylines are compelling.
Characters needs and flaws
universes are different yet similar to ours
When I read a comic book, I feel like...
It really pumps me up
art work makes the story...

So that when you tell her about it, you're honestly speaking "off the cuff" - prepared off the cuff, but off the cuff nonetheless. This ensures that your interactions are legitimate and not scripted, but at the same time, you're preparing an arsenal of things to talk about. This is a passion, so you can fill in the blanks, and get into it. Just avoid the tendency to get too detailed - unless she asks.

If you hook her on your ideas, then it's possible, maybe even likely, she asks you to explain a character. Again, I'd stick to minimal descriptions, and avoid getting too detailed about how cool this or that is. Comics have the stigma associated with them of being a juvenile pursuit, you need to make it clear to her that you appreiate them on a more adult and deeper level.

*pardon the typos... shitty laptop keyboard!*

Mr. Rogers wrote:You could describe any of those shows almost the same way as the comics. But instead of her not giving 2 shits about the rivalry between Professor X. and Magneto, shes thinking more along the lines of Lauren vs. Spencer/Heidi.

I thik what we just learned here is that Mr. Rogers has a terrible secret of watching chick shows! j/k

qixsilver wrote:Mr Rogers. Maybe I misunderstood you, but when you commented that she should be responsible for 80-90% to your 10-20% I interpret that as her dominting/controlling the conversation.

Regarding grounding your world via theirs, I think is a risky game. The girl you meet may hate the hills, when you try to relate the two, suddenly, you're debating why the hills sucks - or doesnt suck - vs. conveying your idea.

I do agree on your coments re. tidal's specific example, and I'll use it to explain how I would handle it, which leads me to...

Tidal:
GREAT explanation of why you're into comics, BUT far to specific. With most women, as soon as you start talking about mutants or specific characters and their powers, they're going to tune it out. Remember with specifics, what's elementary to you, is NOT to them. for someone who doesnt read comics, Professor X is just a weird name, and Magneto, well, I wont go there. Using your words, here's what I'd keep (ok, I may reword a little)

I love comics because the storylines are so compelling. Characters grow up having severe needs and flaws, make friends, sacrificies, tough choices, and change-- all for the greater good. The universes they inhabit are frighteningly and intensely different than our own (but they share commonalities with us). When I read a comic book, I feel like I'm in the character's shoes, taking the wild rollercoaster ride that is the plot on a journey of limitless possibilities. It really pumps me up. And the art work makes the story (really come to life).

I wouldn't deliver this story as an opener, or as attraction material, but when in comfort, you've already generated attraction and most women at this point are open to listen to you and want to know what "makes you tick". If you have attraction, then by telling a girl why your hobby is more of a passion and what makes it such an integral part of your world will be interesting to her. I'd probably preface a hobby that has a dorky stereotype with a laughing comment about how you know the stigma. Maybe a prefacing segway like:

*note, this should be delivered as an obvious joke - overly straightfaced I'm thinking?!*
"Yeah, I'm a dork, I'm into pocket protectors, bug collecting and comic books. Oh! and I like to yodel on the weekends!" Let her laugh (hopefully she is laughing at your jokes - even the bad ones?) and after she's had her giggle, move to "no, seriously though, I am into comic books..." and launch into why.

By prefacing something that you know has a bad stereotype with worse things, and laughing at it, you let her know that you don't take it too seriously - which alleviates some of the dork vibe from it. Following that with a well thought out, normal minded rationalle that she may not have considered - that this cool guy who she just met is clearly passionate about - then she can accept it and appreciate it on the same deeper level that you do.

That said, learn the story, and then forget it. Don't memorize it word for word. If you do, then you'll just be an actor delivering his lines to her. If you feel like you have to memorize something, then memorize talking points like:

storylines are compelling.
Characters needs and flaws
universes are different yet similar to ours
When I read a comic book, I feel like...
It really pumps me up
art work makes the story...

So that when you tell her about it, you're honestly speaking "off the cuff" - prepared off the cuff, but off the cuff nonetheless. This ensures that your interactions are legitimate and not scripted, but at the same time, you're preparing an arsenal of things to talk about. This is a passion, so you can fill in the blanks, and get into it. Just avoid the tendency to get too detailed - unless she asks.

If you hook her on your ideas, then it's possible, maybe even likely, she asks you to explain a character. Again, I'd stick to minimal descriptions, and avoid getting too detailed about how cool this or that is. Comics have the stigma associated with them of being a juvenile pursuit, you need to make it clear to her that you appreiate them on a more adult and deeper level.

*pardon the typos... shitty laptop keyboard!*

Thank you-- such a detailed, clear explanation of what to do or not do. I can see now that my frame took the whole thing and emphasized it as, "Get into this because it's REALLY IMPORTANT." I guess it was basically the equivalent of coming on to a girl too hard, too fast. The funny thing is I don't think these comics are all that great any more and definitely see that it's lame / pointless to be going on about them. I just wanted to know how to get a girl to like something I liked. Your advice makes a ton of sense, I feel really lucky that I'm on a board where you post. That first line about yodeling on the weekends takes the sting out of the "THIS IS SO IMPORTANT AND DETAILED" vibe my lines were giving off. As you can see, I am an ex-comic book junkie so that passion can still take over no matter how geeky it might turn things (ugh!). And I love your minimalist approach, it's brilliant. Memorizing the mainpoints rather than how to say something-- again, you're changing my life with these words. Growing up I did stand up comedy and I'd literally memorize each word I had to say and the timing that went with it before I got up on stage. I fear lack of structure that much. This way, I still have the structure. Silver, you're my new hero!

It's also the best way to talk to masses of people, like in a university or whatever giving a presentation. you want to know all the details about the subject you're talking about in you head, it has to be ready knowledge.

Then you only take a couple of subjects, which you know you want to discuss and you just talk about it making the whole story up right there, sometimes you might wanna stop in the middle of a sentence and rephrase, whatever, but it comes off the most natural, you'll use body language more and people will be listening to what you're saying more. because remember, the contents is only 7% off what you're saying, like 50% is body language (and what was the other 43%?). Body language is mostly unconcious, and used when you're making a story up on the spot, talking naturally.

You change ANY subject and ANY line into a sexual one, or steer it a s. direction anyway. For instance I like comics because rolercoaster, it's the unkown, I love adventures, mysteriousness. These words and idea's are generally what makes sex so awsome.

I love adventures, though I'm really well behaved. Then confess... well not really ok I'm lying sometimes I'm a bit naughty, for instance I LOOOVEEE making out... dunno why I just love it. Is that a bad thing??? *innocent look* chicks love that.

Mr wrote:...Then you only take a couple of subjects, which you know you want to discuss and you just talk about it making the whole story up right there, sometimes you might wanna stop in the middle of a sentence and rephrase, whatever, but it comes off the most natural, you'll use body language more and people will be listening to what you're saying more. because remember, the contents is only 7% off what you're saying, like 50% is body language (and what was the other 43%?). Body language is mostly unconcious, and used when you're making a story up on the spot, talking naturally....

You got it Mr! Memorize enough that you don't miss anything that you feel is important to convey, but ONLY so that you don't forget something in the heat of the moment. From there just be yourself.

addendum

Mr. I really like the way you segway OUT of the comic book story, bringing the discussion back to how adventurous and "normal" (i lie, im passionate etc) you really are, and tying that back into something like making out actually sexualizes something that could otherwise have a flat ending. Nice work!

I just got conscious about the fact that I use that mostly:
Telling how shy/well behaved/ I am in a really confident way, a little TOO confident...

*at this point she won't beleive what you're saying*

Then confessing to her.. Ok sorry I'm lying.. I might be a little bit bad sometimes.

*you share a secret together, only the two of you know. And it's something she likes.. *

Then asking if it's a bad thing.

*She DOESN'T think it's a bad thing, she loves being naughty. And you asking her for it? THAT'S SOOO CUTE*