MyPUAJourney Forum

I'm pretty new at this so i need some help from guys who are experienced. This girl I know is leaving for nashville on the 20th, I want to meet up with her before then, but problem is im not very good at being dominant over text up until earlier ive been really beta but i think i got her jumping in my frame now.. This is how the convo started...

Me: So, this is ur last week huh?

Her: Yea

Me: I want to chill with you before you leave but if not its no big deal just be real with me

Her: Ok

Me: If you cant before you leave, just delete my number on the 21st

Her: Wow (First Emotional spike)

Me: I want to chill with you, since your leaving but if I cant just do what i said...

Her: But damn, its gotta be like that?

Up until now, she's been controlling the frame but my friend helped me take some back, with her emotional WOW, and then saying "but, damn its gotta be like that"? Just shows that she is giving me the frame in my opinion but guys help me on where to go from here?

the nice thing about forums is that they give you an opportunity to hear multiple opinions. this forum is also intimate enough to where we can get a feel for each users style so you can kind of base their advice and opinions off of that. i'll voice my opinion, but you should take it with a grain of salt. i have my own approach to phone game and these are purely my opinionated opinions. feel free to disagree and don't take offense to anything i say. i'll emphasize my point about not taking offense to what i say once more because i'm sure to offend. having said that, here's my advice and opinions:

first off, i'm not a fan of the texts so far. i can see what you're trying to do, but i don't think it's working quite the way you want it to. in your second text, you state a lot of interest and even emotion. it comes across as weak and needy imo. you mention how you WANT to hang out with her when instead she should be wanting to hang out with you. you should be doing things regardless and then inviting her along to do them with you.

you also state in your second text how you want her to be real with you. you mention how it's no big deal if she can't but by stating, "just be real with me," you kinda of negated that. you shouldn't give a shit if she's being real or not because you should always assume she is being real. if the girl's attracted or at the very least, truly interested in you, she's not gonna lead you on. you shouldn't mention how it's not a big deal either. think of it this way: does a homeless guy who smells like shit have to tell you he's homeless? No, because it's apparent in the way he simply is. if something truly is what it is, it doesn't have to be said. mentioning it just makes it sound false, as if you're trying to convince someone out of desperation. the fact that it's not a big deal to you should be stressed through the way you invite her along to join you in an activity you wish to do regardless of her attendance. ASKING her to be real is weak and emotional, i.e., not attractive.

if you don't wish to do something and instead you seriously just want to chill, that's fine. just say that though. a simple text like, "we should hang out before you leave," works well. then leave it at that. if she's interested, she'll respond. this text is non-needy and is simply a suggestion, not a request.

your 3rd text where you tell her to just delete your number is not something i'd advise. i see you're trying to sound dominant and as if you don't care, but it sounds very emotional and weak imo. it comes across as if you just want to forget all about her and never speak to her again if you can't hang out because it's just too much for you to take. this is the kind of emotional hysteria you expect to hear when a couple breaks up. the girl gets all crazy and tells the guy to deleter her number and to move on because she can't bare to see him again. my point is that it really gives off a bad vibe.

i think her wow was in response to how emotional you seem to be. you seem to be making a big deal out of meeting up with her whiling trying to convince her it's not. in your fourth text, you're repeating yourself. once again i revert back to my homeless man example. you're pleading your case which just negates the message you're trying to deliver even more. never try to convince someone of something directly with words. letting someone come to the assumption on their own is far more powerful and convincing for them. imply what you want to convey or better yet, let your actions speak for you.

her last text is more or less a statement of confusion on her part imo. she's probably wondering why the hell you're being so intense. too much dominance is no different from too much arrogance. they appear as insecurities in the end. some slave owners dominated the living hell out of their slaves way back when, and i can guarantee those slaves weren't attracted to their owners. they probably thought they were pieces of shit with control and self-esteem issues.

a lot of things in life and game teeter around a delicate balance. too much of anything is never a good thing.

generating interest and attraction over text is difficult and gets old fast. generally texting can lead nowhere in a hurry if every text isn't geared toward meeting up with her. by this i mean you should be setting a means for her to join you in a fun task, not talking about how you'd like to hang with her. emphasize a time and place, not a want and desire.

Rhetoric is dead on. Your texts are coming off like you are really afected emotionally by her not getting together with you "Just delete my number" etc.. A big rule is NEVER SHOW A WOMAN THAT SHE IS AFFECTING YOUR EMOTIONAL STATE. If she see's that, she's gone.

Being dominant is not about being mean and bossy. "Delete my number" isn't dominant. Dominant would look like this "I'm free on Saturday, let's get together then and go tear some shit up cutie"...ie... telling her, not asking her. I know you're new dude, but never try and be a dick, it doesn't work and if it does by some chance then you're dealing with a very low self-esteem girl, and who wants a girl like that? Never be mean or rude, if you're put in a position too by a girl then say nothing and move on...I've found that mother nature's karma is a mean bitch and it will come back on you!

To add to that, being mean and arguing with a girl shows you need something from her...you want to be non-needy, having a not giving a shit and abundance mindset.

@ Rhetoric, you douchebag! You totally stole my advice.

@ Juice, I hope you're not offended by what Rhetoric said, you shouldn't be, he's giving some great advice there on breaking down the text and how it probably came off to her. I agree with Thai as well, you should be dominant in a positive way - not a negative/dramatic one.

That said, you may have fucked up, but so what? Learn from it and don't sweat it man!

Here's the only thing I'd add to all of this, and I'm sure some will disagree with me: Texting should not be used to build on attraction or comfort. If you find yourself having a conversation via text, pick up the phone, and schedule a date - maybe an instant one (something like "This is getting too detailed, lets grab a coffee/drink/whatever" - I know those are no-no's for day 2's, but for instant, spur of the moment dates, I think they're ok/natural - anyone else agree or disagree with that?). I've heard a lot of guys discuss "text game" and quite frankly, there shouldn't be such a thing in my opinion - at least not very in depth. Texts should be concise and to the point, and always with a goal in mind. "Hey, I just thought of the most amazing thing - call me!" or "I'm at XXX's and the band here is amazing, come on out, I'll be the guy in the gorilla suit!" In short in my opinion, texts should be a means to an end - like Thai said.

Also, just a general suggestion / way I think you should be thinking - based on the tone of your texts above, you may not be doing this: You want to make sure that you're always the fun guy in her life. If you find yourself offering ultimatums, or coming off as begging/needy, then you need to stop immediately (that can be a hard habit to break at first!). Sometimes you can do damage control with something like "that's probably how your ex boyfriend talked to you right? Aren't you lucky that I'm not like him? God he'd probably have a detective following you around too..." Go over the top and reframe it as a joke if you think you can get away with it. Sadly, I don't think you can do that with this particular situation without coming off as a fake, but in the future, if you see yourself having just sent a text like that, you might be able to reframe it as a joke, but if you've sent multiple texts, or said multiple things, then you're probably too late, suck it up and move on. But i digress - back to being the fun guy - If your interactions with her aren't fun, she's going to lose interest - she can get drama from her girlfriends or from work - let her get drama there - she should get fun from you, that way she want's to be with you (you've provided social value to her and because you're sustaining that value, you are attractive to her). If your interactions aren't leaving her with the desire to be around you - because it's fun - then you're likely going to lose her.

That said, you can - and should - still have a moment or two on Oprah's couch with her, but that should be done to build comfort in order to show her that you're real - sharing meaningful stories or experiences from your life (careful with those stories tho - that's a WHOLE different topic!). BUT, she should never feel like you're a problem that she has to fix - or that you're presenting her a problem that she has to fix. If she does, then you're not fun anymore and it's bye-bye or worse still, welcome to the friend zone. ESPECIALLY early on in the relationship.

That's where I think you goofed up on your texts - you presented her a problem and demanded that she fix it (either do something with me or delete me).

OK, Open up the floodgates for disagreement, and as I said before man, don't feel bad about this girl, we all fuck up sometimes.

first off there's some great advice from qix and thai. i especially like thai's example text - to the point, alpha, and it comes across well.

two points i'll make in regards to qix's post:

i see nothing wrong with the instant date idea. in fact i think it's pretty good. generally you want to avoid getting into conversations over text. same thing applies to phone calls. they should be short and have a purpose (more on this in a second). an instant date is a good idea imo. conversations work best in person because you can't get a feel for sarcasm, humor, etc. over texts. also she can't see your body language which is important. if you slip up and say something dumb in person, you can easily recover. say something dumb over text or over the phone and it's far more difficult. truth be told, i see nothing wrong with grabbing coffee or tea as a day 2. sure it's not the best day 2 locale, but it works. it comes down to how you can keep her entertained. in fact, one of my stronger day 2s in recent time took place in a parking lot - anything is possible.

as far as text game or more importantly, phone game, goes... i actually think it's rather important. phones are a technology that we use everyday and when we go out, we generally get girls phone numbers because that's the easiest and fastest way to keep in touch. text (also a part of phone game) are important too imo because a girl will often times not be willing to talk on the phone right away. they generally prefer text. also sending a particular text can help insure she'll answer. many people screw up with their phone game. many guys can get numbers, in fact that's the easy part. it what you're able to do with the number that counts. this is where phone game comes in. it's very easy to loose a girl with a simple slip up in a text or phone call. the problem that juice is having is VERY common. few guys know when to call vs text, what to say, whether or not to leave a voice mail and what to say on it, how to set up a date on the phone, how to start a conversation on the phone. text also come in handy when you can't meet up with a girl for a while. it's important to keep her thinking of you. you can do this with a simple text every other day or so.

this stuff is rather simple and a good understanding of it all can be rather brief, but i feel it's quite important none the less.

like i mentioned, all calls and texts should generally be geared toward a meet up. building attraction over the phone is unlikely. in fact i have a big disagreement with what most people refer to as attraction. i feel most people confuse attraction with interest but that's getting off topic. building interest is possible over the phone but it's best done in person. i'll admit to having long conversation over the phone either through talking or texts, but my conversations are always building in intensity and never dull. once i've built up to a high point, i cut the conversation off and then next day i'll use that interest to secure a meet up with one text or a 2 minute phone call.

I think this is kind similar to what was posted in your other thread :

http://mypuajourney.freeforums.org/i-need-a-kick-to-the-nuts-i-fucked-up-decent-t635.html

All the guys that have posted on here have made some good points. I wont repeat.

I have also made points to the same effect or similar on the above thread.

What i will say, is that girls can play this texting game for ever, cause it is easy for them , and it feels like a game. I have been on these long texting convos a lot of times. Plus girls are doing this with possibly more than one guy at a time.

Personally i try to use text, to make second contact after getting a number, keep in touch, create some fun or emotion or mystery. I then try and get that person on the phone and talking, and have what i would say in a text convo over the phone in a shorter time space.

I do believe and do try to use the principle of using phones as a means of setting up dates. but after a while and a few dates, you use the phone to talk more and build comfort and attraction.

For me, it is hard to express my total communication through texting, better in msn, than voice, than peron (always the best way).

some one wrote that , you cant just write a paragraph text and she writes a one line or word response, not good. I would take this further, and mention that you dont write texts to girls (regardless if they friends or sexual interest especically) the same way you would write to your male friends. that means no lond winded, detailed oreinted messages, or straight to the point answers. Its the same principle as for talking to girls on the phone, through msn, or in person (duh).

Juice, all women try and control the frame, a lot suceed, and thus attraction is lost or is being lost. This is what testing is all about and also what dominance and leader ship is too. If she is not trying to control the frame, then i would be worried. If she is controlling the frame, i would take it back. This will happen in any form of communication.

From the convo, she is controlling the frame, by also how much she is investing in the convo - which is very little. Its like the adult who is listening to the little child and say yes or no or very little stuff. what she is saying is obvious, i will leave it to you to figure it out.

I would also say that if am talking about football (round ball) and she talks about tennis, what ever topic you continue, you control the frame. Now you can or partial agree, and talk about what you were saying - well you have to do this in a more polished way. This method is a behaviour management technique for control the frame and maintaining the leadership of the class.

Hope this helps

You're fucked. Move on.